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> Another issue is Sign in with Apple’s “Hide My Email” feature. With this feature, if you create an account with us, Apple will generate a special email address just for that account. So rather than your email address being john.doe@icloud.com, we will see your email address as something like dpdcnf87nu@privaterelay.appleid.com.

Ironically, this is also why I use Sign Up with Apple at every opportunity I can



How is this ironic? It is by design and obviously they know why people do it because the very next sentence says that. Why on Earth would you'd want to use a list-sharing app that uses email as the addressing system and then not share your email.


The anonymous e-mail that Sign-In with Apple generates forwards to the e-mail used to set up your Apple ID. So it's not like it's a random e-mail that acts as a /dev/null.

This is by far the biggest selling point of Sign-In with Apple for me and I will continue to use it, and continue to not use apps that don't support it. I have plenty of e-mail aliases, but having an alias auto-generated for you is very convenient, and not having to generate a secure password is also very convenient.

The day AnyList gets hacked (not saying it will - but it's highly likely, the way security has taken a backseat due to "features") then at least my personal e-mail and password won't be there for every hacker on Earth to see and try to spam passwords to get into all of my other accounts.


Perhaps you don't use AnyList? It doesn't make sense to use with a private mail relay because they use email as an addressing system. And honestly, few users will go look up their per-app address and tell people to add them.


This is where their article lost credibility with me. Their decision to base their sharing and addressing system on email was their mistake, and Apple is just the first to force them to face their mistake.

I don't want to share my spam email with all my friends to get them to share with me. And I don't want to give my primary email to an app that will spam me.

If I want to share something, I'll send a link and the recipient can connect to me that way. I don't need to search them within the app to get in contact, that's useless.

> so when they enter your email address, our systems will believe that you don’t have an account. At that point, you’ll get an email from us asking you to create an account.

This is a trivial part of the problem to solve. Why am I being asked to create an account in an invite email? Why not "log in or create account" and having the link itself be the piece that connects the share to me.


It's not a mistake, by any means.

It's dead clear that you don't work with consumers. Your technical bias shows what you care about and you're(an me) are an utter minority.

If you want security, btw - you should have multiple passwords for different things. And ideally not even use a password manager.


Why should he not use a password manager?


You're storing all of your password in one location. Behind just one password.

What's the point in password manager, if all you need is one time auth - and you're in!


Ah, I wasn't aware that e-mail was used as an addressing system within AnyList. Do users not have any usernames associated with their e-mails?

Still, I think in this day and age, having a requirement in your product that says "e-mail that is provided should be the one the user uses the most" is pretty naive. In general, it's true, but when it comes to 3rd party authentication providers like Facebook, Google, and now Apple, this kind of requirement is not really useful and will likely cause issues for you down the line, which is why usernames are better for addressing people within apps (e.g, Instagram handles).


It is rather unusual, honestly. Even Venmo uses just an app-specific name. That's probably a lesson in product design: have your own usernames.


I'd personally for for the method used by Blizzard and Discord where a randomly generated ID is the actual unique value, while the username is just a display setting.


I get all the advantages of that but for some reason it's so hard when you get into a game and you're trying to get everyone there into a discord.

Riot does this with Valorant too and the implementation is a nightmare.


Small nit: Potential hackers would only have access to your email, provider id and whatever other details they pass along (preferred name, profile picture URL, etc.). Social login doesn't provide consumers (AnyList in this case) with your password.


Agreed, social login like Facebook et. al do not provide passwords to consumers, but e-mail is already contentious enough.

Most people use the same e-mail for every single account they have. A large majority of these users use the same password for all of their accounts. (Just want to clarify that I do neither of these things - I have a large set of e-mail aliases and have a unique & secure password for each account I have to set up manually).

If you'll grant me that fact, then all I need is your e-mail from a dump of AnyList's users table, and look up that e-mail in my already vast database of dumped tables, and see that your password was "hunter2". Now I have access to your bank account, because you used the same e-mail and password for that account as well.

This is a bit of a contrived example, but in general, any personal information that is leaked (e-mail included) is bad - full name, address, and the like, which many websites ask for, is even worse, because crackers have even a better shot at guessing a lot of your personal information, and at that point, the ball is in their park.


FYI: Getting a hold of someones' email isn't particularly hard.


So you say you are using your email as the unique identifier instead of the password?

If you use a unique password for every service, what would you need a unique email for?


> If you use a unique password for every service, what would you need a unique email for?

Because then you control when the flow of marketing or "Service" related email stops. And you can tell which vendor leaked your email either deliberately or by accident.


It's ironic because anylist cites that as a reason to stop supporting that very feature. That would only reduce my desire to Sign Up for that app.


As a reminder - us privacy aware technical people aren't remotely relevant anymore. So... You're not their target audience.


Apparently Apple makes privacy by default their PR strategy. So it's kinda relevant, at least in Apple garden.


The article also implies that if anyone can guess your email address, they can send you/share with you a list. I wonder what anti-spam measures AnyList implements?


Sign In With Apple would require that AnyList enable SPF protections on any outbound domain registered with Apple for SIWP use:

To send emails to users with private email addresses, you must register your outbound emails or email domains and use Sender Policy Framework (SPF) to authenticate your outbound emails.


I assume they rely on the fact that sharing a random list with a random person a thousand times is pointless.


What if the list contains/is itself advertising, and the random person is everyone on a huge list of active email accounts?


Why would you go through the trouble of sharing a list when you can just email them directly?


If they really needed a user ID, just have account holders create a username after the Apple sign-in flow. Most people have a go-to username, and those are easy enough to remember and give to a support associate.




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